Saturday, 14 June 2025

The Trinity made comprehensible.

 

Tomorrow is Trinity Sunday

I have two special reasons for being interested in the doctrine of the Trinity. One, because I live in a row of houses called Trinity Terrace, (so named because it says in my deeds that the builder bought the land from the ”Masters and Fellows of the College of the Holy and Undivided Trinity, Cambridge.)  The other arises from an incident when I was at junior school.

I was a fairly biddable school boy, not so much from innate goodness as fear – corporal punishment was rampant - but one occasion when I transcended the rules and suffered the indignity of being “kept in” (thankfully not the “double ruler”) sticks in my mind.

The church in which I was baptised and sang in the choir from about the age of seven had Choral Matins as its main Sunday morning service.  Every month in which there were five Sundays, we sang on the final, extra Sunday the Athanasian Creed instead of the usual Apostles’ Creed.  Whether there was some theological basis for this, or it was just a quirk of the vicar, I have no idea.

When I was in Standard 3, as it was then called, around the age of nine, the teacher said something, I don’t remember what, which trigged me to whisper to my desk-mate “the Father incomprehensible, the Son incomprehensible, and the Holy Ghost, incomprehensible and yet there are not three incomprehensible, but one incompressible.”

“Peter Wrigley, were you talking?”

“Er, well er . .”

“You will stay in at playtime and write down what you said.”.

So I did.  How I spelt it I wouldn’t like to say.  Nor have I any idea what Miss Parr made of the bit of paper I nervously handed to her, but I was allowed to go out and finish playtime.

So, with that background, allow me to explain what I believe is a rational basis of that which St Athanasius found incomprehensible.

God the Father.

It is not irrational to suppose that somehow the universe began.  I hesitate to write that some one or some thing began it, because that implies a person or a physical entity.  Better, I believe, to think of a cause. Better still, a force. 

There is nothing particularly modern about this idea.  The Church of England’s  Thirty-nine Articles, agreed in 1562, stipulate that “God” is not an old man with a long beard, resting on a bed on the Seventh Day, but “without body , parts or passions.”

Maybe the force has a purpose, or maybe not.  Maybe the force is benevolent, or maybe evil, or perhaps indifferent to what happens to the universe and the creatures in it.

Maybe the force intervenes in the universe and the lives of the creature in it.

Maybe not.

Maybe we shall never know.

But it is probably best for humankind to think positively and assume benevolence.

God the Son

The world’s different religions have different interpretations of the nature of the force. or forces, where, as with the Ancient Greeks and Romans, there were assumed to be numerous Gods, each with a different purpose. Our tradition is based on the opinions and teachings of what we call the Old Testament Prophets and what many believe to be the final revelation in the life teaching and example of Jesus Christ, along with  the writers of the New Testament Epistles.   Some regard additions by later sources  (eg the Early Fathers  Julian of Norwich, George Fox, various Papal pronouncements, Don Cupitt) as adding to our understanding.  Muslims go further and believe that Mohammed (peace be upon him) has the final say.

From these revelations we learn that the Force is benevolent, can be simply described as “love,” is endlessly forgiving and, “like a father,” wanting us to love even our enemies and care for each other and the creation.

God the Holy Ghost

Most Christians have already moved on from ghosts and now refer to the “Holy Spirit.” I suggest we can now take a further step and refer to the "Force."  The Force is still at work in the world (maybe even the Universe) and is available, if we so wish, to latch on to in order to help us lead the kind of lives we are intended to live: to strengthen our resolve and to protect us from any “perils and dangers” we might encounter.  This, again is not a fanciful idea.  We all find “safety in numbers” and assume that associating with others with similar aims by some mysterious means creates a bond, a force,  which strengthens and enables us in fulfilling our goals.  Regiments try to embolden their soldiers by appealing to its  “spirit,” traditions and ceremonies: football supporters  assume that cheering the teams creates  a force on spurs them on to victory.

Star Wars provides us with the modern version:  “The Force be with you.”

QED.

Or “Amen.”

It’s not incomprehensible, but perfectly logical and believable.

20 comments:

  1. This looks a lot like the old, old heresy of Modalism.

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    1. (With a side helping of syncretic indifferentism, also heretical)

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    2. Also possibly psilanthropism? Difficult to tell.

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  2. Agreed it could be read like that, but not necessarily. Clearly Jesus is a separate entity to the other two. Perhaps it would be clearer if I had given different names to the "Force as Creator" and the "Force as helper and sustainer." But they can be three separate entities of the Godhead (Forcehead?) if that is important to you.

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    1. But they can be three separate entities of the Godhead (Forcehead?) if that is important to you.

      If you saying the Persons are separate entities then you are committing the heresy of partialism.

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    2. I think you need to watch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQLfgaUoQCw

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  3. The above comment refers to Modalism. This one is to psilanthropism. I haven't written that Jesus was not truly God. All I have said is that his teaching, life and example are believed to be the fullest and most complete revelation of the nature of the Force. That doesn't stop Him (note the capital) from being "divine" if that is important to you.

    Syncretic indifferentism: again you are accusing me of something I haven't written. I have acknowledged that other cultures have had and still have different explanations of the Force and how we are meant to behave to each other and the physical and spiritual worlds. That is a fact. I haven't written that they are all equally valid. If you want to believe that yours (ours) is the only correct one and all the others are wrong that is a matter for you.

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    1. I haven't written that Jesus was not truly God. All I have said is that his teaching, life and example are believed to be the fullest and most complete revelation of the nature of the Force.

      Hence why I wrote 'Possibly […] difficult to tell.' Nothing you wrote was incompatible with Christianity in that way (as opposed to the Modalism, which was plain to see).


      If you want to believe that yours (ours) is the only correct one and all the others are wrong that is a matter for you.

      It's not, though, is it? It's a question of facts and logic. If person A thinks that Jesus was the Son of God, born of a virgin and rose from the dead, and person B thinks that Jesus was a great moral teacher or maybe a prophet but definitely human, who lived and died and was not resurrected*, then it's not a matter of 'belief' or a 'matter for you' that they simply cannot both be correct.

      There's simply no way in which, if one of those is correct, then they other — all others —— aren't wrong. That is simply how facts and logic work. If A is true, than not-A cannot also be true.

      * I am aware that some Muslims think that Jesus did not die on the cross but was taken directly to Heaven while a duplicate body was left to hang in his place, thank you, so we don't need to go down that tangent. Suffice it to says that if that is true then, again, all other views (eg the Christian one or the view that Jesus was only a human who died a normal human death) must be wrong.

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    2. Sorry missed out a bit. After: '(as opposed to the Modalism, which was plain to see).' insert:

      However, defining Christianity by reference to 'the final revelation in the life teaching and example of Jesus Christ' is a bit odd because while Christians certainly do see revelation in the life, teaching and example of Jesus, it's not really the thing that's most distinctive about Christianity, that being the rather surprising fact that a carpenter in the Middle East turned out to be the incarnate God, creator of the universe, who died to save us from the consequence of our sins and was raised to life again.

      I mean that's kind of a bigger deal, conceptually, than the 'life, teaching and example of Jesus', do you not think? So mentioning he one and not the other is a bit suspect. Might make people suspect you've gone a bit Bultmann-y. Especially if you go on to mention noted anti-Christian Don Cupitt.

      So I just suggest, if you're going to do things like that, you need to go to efforts to make it extra-specially clear that you're not promoting syncretic indifferentism.

      Otherwise people might think, mistakenly, that you are. And I admit that may be unfair, but sadly, we live in a world where such misunderstandings can happen.

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  4. Thanks for your further comments. I have found this discussion both interesting and mildly enlightening (so far.) I realise that in orthodox Christian theology there is much more to Jesus than simply an "explainer " the God's purpose for us. What I have tried to do in the post is give an explanation of the Trinity that is rational and logical and does not require a "leap of faith."

    As well as being an enthusiastic member of the Church of England, deriving much enjoyment and inspiration from its liturgy and music, I also attend a Quaker Meeting. "Friends" place greater emphasis on "correct practice" rather than "correct belief." In other words, how closely we follow the teachings and example of Jesus is more important than what exactly we believe about "Him" (capital letter again.) The latter can degenerate into arguments akin to the alleged medieval preoccupation with how many angels can dance on the point of a pin, which can be entertaining but not much help in living a good life.

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    1. What I have tried to do in the post is give an explanation of the Trinity that is rational and logical and does not require a "leap of faith."

      Right, but what I think it is important for anyone reading to understand is that your explanation, however rational and logical it may be, is wrong, and wrong in a way (modalism) that was specifically declared as wrong by the Church in 381AD, a condemnation that has been repeated on many subsequent occasions. So, you know. You are wrong. The Trinity is not one 'Force' that acts in three different ways. That idea was considered at Constantinople, and firmly and unambiguously rejected.

      In other words, how closely we follow the teachings and example of Jesus is more important than what exactly we believe about "Him"

      I hope you don't think I think it matters what we believe about Jesus. What we believe about Jesus matters not one jot. The only thing that matters is the truth about Jesus.

      It matters, more than anything else in the history of the world, whether Jesus really was the incarnate Creator of the Universe. It matters, more than anything else, whether Jesus really did rise from the dead.

      What you or I or Joe Bloggs happen to believe about those things? Doesn't matter at all.

      St Paul put it rather well in the words that Her Late Majesty (who knew what things were about) chose to be read at her funeral: 'if Christ has not been raised, our preaching is useless and so is your faith. More than that, we are then found to be false witnesses about God, for we have testified about God that he raised Christ from the dead. But he did not raise him if in fact the dead are not raised. For if the dead are not raised, then Christ has not been raised either. And if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins. Then those also who have fallen asleep in Christ are lost. If only for this life we have hope in Christ, we are of all people most to be pitied.'

      If Christ did not rise from the dead, then Christians are pathetic idiots, throwing their lives away for a fantasy. It doesn't matter what they believe. Why would it? Truth, and only truth, matters; belief doesn't matter.

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  5. You claim that the Truth about the nature of the Trinity is important, but, as Pilate famously asked, "What is truth.?" You and I have more evidence than has been available than ever before on the present political and economic state of Britain and the world, but we rarely agree on the truth (or do you simply take your extreme positions to "test" me?). On the nature of the Trinity we have little evidence and much speculation. You accuse me of the Modalist heresy. I've agreed that the original post can be read that way, but not necessarily. It's an interesting discussion, but does it make any difference? Much more important (and this is "my" truth,) is how closely we follow the teaching and example of Jesus, than what exactly we believe about the exact nature of the Trinity.

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  6. as Pilate famously asked, "What is truth.?"

    Do you read about those events and think, 'clearly Pilate is the person worth listening to! He really knew what was going on; a fine, upstanding, courageous model of a man of responsibility!'?

    You accuse me of the Modalist heresy. I've agreed that the original post can be read that way, but not necessarily.

    If there's another way of reading it I really can't see what it is. Your explanation of the Trinity seemed pretty clear and unambiguous to me: there's one Force, which acts, or reveals itself, or is perceived by us, in three different ways. Was that not what you wrote? If not then please do elucidate what the alternative reading is, because for the life of me I can't comprehend what it could possibly be.

    Much more important (and this is "my" truth,) is how closely we follow the teaching and example of Jesus, than what exactly we believe about the exact nature of the Trinity.

    But why is following the teaching and example of Jesus important? It seems to me that if Jesus is the Incarnate Creator of the Universe, who died and rose again, then yes, listening to this singular cosmological event is pretty important. But on the other hand if Jesus was just the son of a carpenter who presumably dropped a wooden block on his head when he was a child, causing him to wander around sleeping in boats and yelling at fig trees and spouting bonkers nonsense about the knocking down the temple and ushering in the kingdom of heaven, then we probably shouldn't follow the teaching or example of this Galilean nutjob at all.

    Would you not agree?

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  7. I've now watched and enjoyed your link to the St Patrick video and see that it is possible to nitpick almost any attempt to explain the Trinity, so I'm in good company.

    Re Pilate, I note you attack the man rather than the message: a common debating device.

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    1. Pilate, I note you attack the man rather than the message: a common debating device.

      Um, no. I attacked the message (that 'truth' doesn't matter) in my paragraph beginning 'But why…'

      You were the one who brought up Pilate in a spurious attempt to give your point extra weight with a misguided appeal to authority (another common, invalid, debating tactic); I was simply pointing out that as well as your point being wrong (demonstrated by that paragraph), your attempted appeal-to-authority was silly as well because your 'authority' was nothing of the sort.

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    2. Oh, and you're not going to try to explain how there's any non-modalist reading of your initial article? Is that because there is no such reading?

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  8. You think my post is heretical: I think it isn't. As I've already explained, I think further discussion is pointless becasue it would not affect how closely we follow the example and teaching of Jesus, which is the important thing. Incidentally another reader has sent me a copy of the sermon he heard on Trinity Sunday in which the preacher compared the Holy Spirt to electricity: when it's "on", the gadgets work, when it's "off" they don't. cf our enthusiasm for living life "abundantly" in the spirit. I'll leave it there.

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    1. You think my post is heretical: I think it isn't.

      ‘Think’ had nothing to do with it. Your article is modalist (unless you can provide an alternative reading, which evidentiary you can’t); modalism is a heresy; therefore the article is heretical.

      No ‘thinking’ required.

      As I've already explained, I think further discussion is pointless becasue it would not affect how closely we follow the example and teaching of Jesus, which is the important thing.

      You also haven’t justified why ‘follow[ing] the example and teaching of Jesus’ Is important.

      Incidentally another reader has sent me a copy of the sermon he heard on Trinity Sunday in which the preacher compared the Holy Spirt to electricity: when it's "on", the gadgets work, when it's "off" they don't. cf our enthusiasm for living life "abundantly" in the spirit.

      I haven’t read the full argument, but that sounds a lot like one of the things Mr Feynman would describe as ‘not even wrong’.

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  9. Hello Peter. It’s Steph from France! Sorry for taking over a comment on your blog . I have sent a few emails but they never seem to deliver! Not sure why! Would be lovely to hear from you. I’m in Spain with my parents and we were talking about you x

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  10. Steph patching29 June 2025 at 07:10

    From Steph

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